A Doyle-thing to think about...

[byslantedlight.livejournal.com]

There's something I've been wondering for a while, off and on, every time I read a fic that reminds me of it, and I'd love to hear what other people think about this. Can anyone tell me:

What is it about canon Doyle that has made fanfic writers portray him as:

a) incredibly selfish

b) incredibly tight with money

I'm really really curious - anyone got any ideas? Are there particular moments that stand out, where he behaves like that? Why do they stand out? Or is it some more general thing? How many people would agree with that portrayal?

It's not that I can't see what might make an author write Doyle like this, it's just that I can't see why he's so often portrayed that way. Whatcha think?

Comments

[byslantedlight.livejournal.com]

Oh, for me that's the whole point too, that's just what I love about fandom! But I am curious about other people's interpretations of things, the way that they see them as opposed (sometimes) to the way that I see them. So really, I was just wondering if anyone saw Doyle's selfishness and meanness with money in the same strong way that some authors seem to have, and if they did what it was in particular that made them pull out those particular idiosyncracies in his character.

I think I've tended to see the various examples that people have given as general joking and teasing between them - whether it's something like Doyle asking for his pen back, or rolling his eyes when Bodie cons him into buying a treble whisky rather than a double, or whatever - and just what people do as well. Of course he moans about his pension being cancelled, and expenses not being paid, and of course Bodie moans about their payrise being overdue, it's what (Brits?) expect to do, isn't it?! (And there's a fab book by Kate Fox called "Watching the English" which goes into all this stuff too, and I was tickled to recognise everything she wrote about, and wincing especially at all the stuff that I did!) I've not taken these at all as money-pinching on Doyle's part, but it sounds like some people have, and that's interesting to me...

Of course my question might actually come more from my own interpretation of the stories that I'm thinking about too, as someone said above, although to me they seem fairly definite in their characterisations! And it's not at all the "new" stories that I'm thinking of, either. (I'm actually quite curious about that idea of Josh's myself, cos I don't see how you can make such a simple distinction - what happens when "old" writers write fic now, what do they become then?!)

I tend to think of fandom and the Pros stories that make it up as a sort of spiderweb - there's all sorts of threads that I can go along, and stretch out just so far with, and they meet with other threads/ideas/interpretations that I can see, and all work together to make stories - the web. But where other people's ideas and interpretations are a bit more different, or further away from what I see, the holes in the web get bigger and bigger until I can't quite get myself around them and believe the story anymore. They're still there, and they're a perfectly good part of the fandom story-web, and just as valuable in holding it up and keeping it together, they're just not ones that I can get to from my part of the web! But now and then I get the urge to ask how it all works, and see if I can step out to those further-away threads! If that makes any sense at all... *g*

As you say, I just have to be convinced within the story that I'm reading - if I can see where a characterisation came from, then that's okay, but when I can't I stumble in the reading. And you really did answer my question, you know, from your own pov, which is just what I was looking for - and you picked some great examples too, which I totally agree with... Oh, and yes I can totally see Doyle as mildly irritating in his not-letting-go thing, but then Bodie too, in a different way, in his not-turning-up-for-obbo thing. So thank you! *g*

[jgraeme2007.livejournal.com]

(I'm actually quite curious about that idea of Josh's myself, cos I don't see how you can make such a simple distinction - what happens when "old" writers write fic now, what do they become then?!)

Well, you know, no matter how I explained it I would inadvertently end up offending someone, so I'm not going to detail my observations. And, of course, a lot of my opinions -- and they are just opinions -- are my initial impressions. I haven't been reading fics for years and years as some of you have.

I haven't read every zine at this point, and while I've probably at least glanced at every fic I could find on the web, many of those were just skimmed or sometimes rejected a few paragraphs in (although I've grown desperate enough to go back and read most of them now).

Certain things stand out very clearly to me -- and certainly some of the differences probably are based on (as someone pointed out) early writers not having the luxury of watching a video over and over and over -- slow moing thru every expression and gesture.

I think one thing that has changed now is that you have very young writers moving from fandom to fandom -- sometimes (as someone pointed out) not even having seen the show they're writing about. I don't think that happened much in the old days without the web to connect writers and readers. I'm sure the community was very different.

Anyway, enough on that topic. It's not germane to the discussion.