The Silence of Knives - and your lads
Sep. 7th, 2007 07:57 am![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
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ci5hqTitle: Silence of Knives
Author: Kathy Keegan
Link to story: Not online
Zine: Fantazine 5
Review:
My first thought on glancing at this story was - oh cool, fic set in Russia, because the action starts out in a place called Vazyabinsk, Cimarosa. By the second paragraph though I had been introduced to Bridgeman North Quarry, Montrose and Yokosuka, in the third paragraph I was told that "the atmosphere was oxygen poor", and by the fourth we were playing with low orbits. AU science fiction, then - set in a highly detailed, clearly conceived futuristic world.
And it really is. There are lots of secondary characters, a past for each of the lads that could be worked up as novels in their own rights (see below!), and oodles and oodles of historical, political and any-other-cal information. The plot is fairly intricate, and weaves from planet to planet via various space-empire-dangers in a reasonably realistic way, considering the genre.
The thing is... (*g*) While the story was good and meaty, and the characters well fleshed out, Bodie and Doyle didn't really seem like Bodie and Doyle to me, and that got me thinking - what exactly is it that makes the lads - the lads? And how far can an author go with characterisation and background before they stop being "the lads" that we might recognise?
Obviously it'll be different for everyone, but I wonder if there are basic characterisations that we miss if they're not there?
In "Silence of the Knives", for example, Doyle is an assassin. He's got a bit of a conscience about it, and it's explained that he's weighed up the good he does against the evil of killing etc, but basically - he's an assassin. He's paid to kill people. For me this is one of the most un-Doyle things that I can think of - in fact, for all Bodie was a mercenary, it's an un-Bodie thing as well. I'm sure there are lots of ways in which it might be made to work, and the reasoning given here is sound etc, but somehow, coupled with the other traits the author has given Doyle, for me it doesn't. Doyle is interested in money as an end in itself. He consciously, purposefully, works himself into a passion about the evil of the man he's sent to kill, but the bottom line is that he's doing it for the money - although he claims "I'm not a murderer". Despite this he's apparently dedicated himself to a "master"/guru/religion. Oh, and this means that he can "turn off pain" whenever he wants to. He's pretty much perfect at everything he does. All of which makes my head spin with not-Doyle-ness.
Bodie's loyalties, on the other hand, seem much more fluid, and somehow more socially idealistic. Bodie is effectively a spy, and is stronger in triple-think and understanding political machinations than Doyle is, which doesn't seem quite right to me either. (Not that I think ep Bodie is an idiot, but if it was going to be either of them, then Doyle always seemed a bit more interested in that sort of thing...) And as I flick back through the pages of the story, I'm not finding anything that distinguishes Bodie from any other hero - he's not exactly not Bodie, but there's nothing that seems to make him Bodie either...
So it all rang a bit strangely to me, which made me wonder what seemed to be missing about our lads that I need to see in a story. I think that, for me right now (cos we all change our minds and evolve our thoughts, right?), at the heart of my lads-verse:
Doyle is a highly skilled agent. He's got a social conscience, with which he struggles to some extent, although CI5 obviously wins. He's quick and strong, but strangely more likely to get hurt than Bodie is - maybe because he's more impetuous? He's got a scary temper - a bit like a beserker maybe *g* - and he's fairly violent despite that conscience, so he's far from a saint. He's thoughtful and keen to find out about all sorts - a detective-type mind that extends to other things, perhaps, and he's always active with something or other, physically, or else tinkering with the bikes etc. He feels for people, whether they've been hurt by society or by an individual, and we see him emotionally hurt in the eps as well. He feels physical pain too, and shows it. He's very familiar with London, has many friends and acquaintances, is very observant, and has a very good memory. He's sharp, but occasionally absent-minded, as we all can be (well, how else do you lose a car? *g*), and is fairly impatient with people who are slower than he is, or between him and something he wants.
Bodie is also a highly skilled and knowledgable agent. He seems less likely to get himself in trouble than Doyle, and outwardly more staunch when he does, but he's also often sensitive to the hurts of individuals, and to being hurt himself. He takes things a bit less seriously, outwardly at at least, although he's just as dedicated to CI5 as Doyle is, and seems to have an easier rapport with Cowley, so I can see him being loyal to Cowley as a person, whereas Doyle might be more loyal to CI5 as an entity. He seems more laid back than Doyle, somehow, although he's just as fit and active... He's well-read, possibly more so than Doyle, although more as a fact of life than as something he's trying to do. Doyle seems to strive more than Bodie, somehow, but they both come out about the same in the end. He's more likely to generalise than Doyle is? Oh, and for all he claimed "It's usually you has to pull me off" to Doyle, his temper, and what he does with it, seems alot more under control.
Both of them seem to be regular blokes - with skills that we don't see all around us in our everyday lives, but with their own everyday lives nevertheless. They're not perfect, they make mistakes, and they want Cowley's approval, and to know that what they're doing makes a difference, because they're not always sure about what they're doing themselves. Neither of them is shut off from emotion, either their own or other peoples', although, like most blokes, they tough it out rather than make a big weepy deal about it. They're casual about alot of things, and not very likely to talk in big, long, explain-y sentences to each other, because alot of their understanding is done via body language. And they've both got alot of self-confidence!
So - I think those are all things that I look for, even if just in the background, in a story. If the lads seem to veer too far from this, then I don't feel like I'm reading Pros fic. The characteristics don't have to be explained, or described, or even acted upon, it's more that if they act too differently from these characteristics, then I'm not convinced it's our lads...
And all that said, there's probably loads of things that I've missed out too, and as soon as someone says "Well, my Bodie..." I'll be jumping, pointing, and going Ooh, yes!
So... I'm curious. (*g*) What's at the very heart of your Bodie and Doyle, that you can't do without in a fic? What are the fics, especially AUs, that do and don't convince you that it's Bodie and Doyle in the story? And did you get extremely frustrated reading my ultra-long ramble up above?! (Sorry about that - though of course I'm going to post it anyway... *g*)
Oh - and one last thing. The Silence of Knives is zine only (as far as I know) but for a general feel of the story you can visit Mel Keegan's site and read about the Hellgate series - many echoes happening here, and the cover of "Deep Sky" makes me go hmmn... *g*
Author: Kathy Keegan
Link to story: Not online
Zine: Fantazine 5
Review:
My first thought on glancing at this story was - oh cool, fic set in Russia, because the action starts out in a place called Vazyabinsk, Cimarosa. By the second paragraph though I had been introduced to Bridgeman North Quarry, Montrose and Yokosuka, in the third paragraph I was told that "the atmosphere was oxygen poor", and by the fourth we were playing with low orbits. AU science fiction, then - set in a highly detailed, clearly conceived futuristic world.
And it really is. There are lots of secondary characters, a past for each of the lads that could be worked up as novels in their own rights (see below!), and oodles and oodles of historical, political and any-other-cal information. The plot is fairly intricate, and weaves from planet to planet via various space-empire-dangers in a reasonably realistic way, considering the genre.
The thing is... (*g*) While the story was good and meaty, and the characters well fleshed out, Bodie and Doyle didn't really seem like Bodie and Doyle to me, and that got me thinking - what exactly is it that makes the lads - the lads? And how far can an author go with characterisation and background before they stop being "the lads" that we might recognise?
Obviously it'll be different for everyone, but I wonder if there are basic characterisations that we miss if they're not there?
In "Silence of the Knives", for example, Doyle is an assassin. He's got a bit of a conscience about it, and it's explained that he's weighed up the good he does against the evil of killing etc, but basically - he's an assassin. He's paid to kill people. For me this is one of the most un-Doyle things that I can think of - in fact, for all Bodie was a mercenary, it's an un-Bodie thing as well. I'm sure there are lots of ways in which it might be made to work, and the reasoning given here is sound etc, but somehow, coupled with the other traits the author has given Doyle, for me it doesn't. Doyle is interested in money as an end in itself. He consciously, purposefully, works himself into a passion about the evil of the man he's sent to kill, but the bottom line is that he's doing it for the money - although he claims "I'm not a murderer". Despite this he's apparently dedicated himself to a "master"/guru/religion. Oh, and this means that he can "turn off pain" whenever he wants to. He's pretty much perfect at everything he does. All of which makes my head spin with not-Doyle-ness.
Bodie's loyalties, on the other hand, seem much more fluid, and somehow more socially idealistic. Bodie is effectively a spy, and is stronger in triple-think and understanding political machinations than Doyle is, which doesn't seem quite right to me either. (Not that I think ep Bodie is an idiot, but if it was going to be either of them, then Doyle always seemed a bit more interested in that sort of thing...) And as I flick back through the pages of the story, I'm not finding anything that distinguishes Bodie from any other hero - he's not exactly not Bodie, but there's nothing that seems to make him Bodie either...
So it all rang a bit strangely to me, which made me wonder what seemed to be missing about our lads that I need to see in a story. I think that, for me right now (cos we all change our minds and evolve our thoughts, right?), at the heart of my lads-verse:
Doyle is a highly skilled agent. He's got a social conscience, with which he struggles to some extent, although CI5 obviously wins. He's quick and strong, but strangely more likely to get hurt than Bodie is - maybe because he's more impetuous? He's got a scary temper - a bit like a beserker maybe *g* - and he's fairly violent despite that conscience, so he's far from a saint. He's thoughtful and keen to find out about all sorts - a detective-type mind that extends to other things, perhaps, and he's always active with something or other, physically, or else tinkering with the bikes etc. He feels for people, whether they've been hurt by society or by an individual, and we see him emotionally hurt in the eps as well. He feels physical pain too, and shows it. He's very familiar with London, has many friends and acquaintances, is very observant, and has a very good memory. He's sharp, but occasionally absent-minded, as we all can be (well, how else do you lose a car? *g*), and is fairly impatient with people who are slower than he is, or between him and something he wants.
Bodie is also a highly skilled and knowledgable agent. He seems less likely to get himself in trouble than Doyle, and outwardly more staunch when he does, but he's also often sensitive to the hurts of individuals, and to being hurt himself. He takes things a bit less seriously, outwardly at at least, although he's just as dedicated to CI5 as Doyle is, and seems to have an easier rapport with Cowley, so I can see him being loyal to Cowley as a person, whereas Doyle might be more loyal to CI5 as an entity. He seems more laid back than Doyle, somehow, although he's just as fit and active... He's well-read, possibly more so than Doyle, although more as a fact of life than as something he's trying to do. Doyle seems to strive more than Bodie, somehow, but they both come out about the same in the end. He's more likely to generalise than Doyle is? Oh, and for all he claimed "It's usually you has to pull me off" to Doyle, his temper, and what he does with it, seems alot more under control.
Both of them seem to be regular blokes - with skills that we don't see all around us in our everyday lives, but with their own everyday lives nevertheless. They're not perfect, they make mistakes, and they want Cowley's approval, and to know that what they're doing makes a difference, because they're not always sure about what they're doing themselves. Neither of them is shut off from emotion, either their own or other peoples', although, like most blokes, they tough it out rather than make a big weepy deal about it. They're casual about alot of things, and not very likely to talk in big, long, explain-y sentences to each other, because alot of their understanding is done via body language. And they've both got alot of self-confidence!
So - I think those are all things that I look for, even if just in the background, in a story. If the lads seem to veer too far from this, then I don't feel like I'm reading Pros fic. The characteristics don't have to be explained, or described, or even acted upon, it's more that if they act too differently from these characteristics, then I'm not convinced it's our lads...
And all that said, there's probably loads of things that I've missed out too, and as soon as someone says "Well, my Bodie..." I'll be jumping, pointing, and going Ooh, yes!
So... I'm curious. (*g*) What's at the very heart of your Bodie and Doyle, that you can't do without in a fic? What are the fics, especially AUs, that do and don't convince you that it's Bodie and Doyle in the story? And did you get extremely frustrated reading my ultra-long ramble up above?! (Sorry about that - though of course I'm going to post it anyway... *g*)
Oh - and one last thing. The Silence of Knives is zine only (as far as I know) but for a general feel of the story you can visit Mel Keegan's site and read about the Hellgate series - many echoes happening here, and the cover of "Deep Sky" makes me go hmmn... *g*
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no subject
Date: 2007-09-08 01:27 am (UTC)No, not quite, though, truthfully, I can't say it's that far off. I suppose the best example would be "The Cook and the Warehouseman." I love that story but there's no way I see Doyle in "Ray." Yet I can go along with the idea that it is Doyle because the story is so well written. So I can't really say that I won't buy a story where Bodie or Doyle isn't "my" Bodie or Doyle because I can. Just not all the time. The writing makes all the difference in the world. In other words, there doesn't seem to be a hard and fast rule as to what Pros stories I'll like...other than that Bodie and Doyle have to end up together.
Cross-overs are a bit weird to me too, cos it generally means that one or the other of our lads has been dealt with so that they can't be together! I can get over that, and enjoy a story if it's good, if I know the other character being crossed-over.
Ah, see, and I can't. It's just too depressing to think one of them has died or never was.
The only Chief/Pros crossover I really like though is the Jack Reuben Darcy one, for very specific reasons hinging on my first sentence - although I just saw a description of a similarly plotted story that might work for me too... Now if only I could remember where I saw it!
I haven't read that one, even though I really like "Saints and Miracle." I think my biggest problem with stories that cross with other shows, then turn out to be not exactly crossovers, is that there's often inconvenient offspring to have to explain. I've yet to read an explanation I particularly cared for. And while I can take a separation of a couple of years, at the most, more than that and it starts to get, well, depressing. It's probably pretty obvious that I usually prefer my angst in small amounts. :-)
no subject
Date: 2007-09-08 07:43 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-09-17 11:57 pm (UTC)Mostly, I think I'm still not comfortable with such a long separation (and after 6 years of partnership and 14 years of separation I'd think the lads would be closer to pushing 50 not 45 but that's another issue.) Anyway, to be that unhappy for that long....
But I think I would have found the story more interesting if Doyle's "daughter" hadn't been quite so agreeable when told about her "father's" sexual orientation. I would have loved to read how Doyle would have handled that!
I know it sounds like I didn't like the story, which isn't true. Like I said, I did enjoy it. I guess that's just one scenario I'm never going to be able to buy wholeheartedly.
no subject
Date: 2007-09-18 08:45 pm (UTC)